In conversation with Manasi Chaudhari, author of women's rights handbook Legally Yours

"Legal knowledge is like health insurance, you hope you never need it, but it is good to have just in case," says Manasi Chaudhari who recently authored Legally Yours: Every Woman's Guide to Her Legal Rights..An alumnus of Oxford University and Jindal Global Law School, Chaudhari has been practicing law before the Supreme Court and the Telangana High Court. While her focus there has been corporate and commercial laws, in 2020, she founded Pink Legal, which is India's first digital platform dedicated to empowering women.This year, she joined Numen Law Offices as a partner and her book was released by Harper Collins. Legally Yours is a handbook for every woman in India to navigate the legal system to protect themselves. It aims to present the complex web of laws in a way that is accessible even to laypersons. The book covers domestic violence, sexual harassment, workplace rights, gender pay gaps, inheritance rights etc. Most importantly, it provides practical advice on how women can protect themselves in the 21st century. .In this interview with Bar & Bench's Giti Pratap, Chaudhari speaks about arming women with legal knowledge, false Section 498A cases, Bollywood's influence on love, marriage and relationships, and more. .[Watch Interview].Edited excerpts follow..Giti: What prompted you to start Pink Legal and later write the book?.Manasi: As a law student, when we visited NGOs and other organisations, I realised that many women there were unaware of laws that exist to protect them. So that is when the seed for starting Pink Legal was born. That seed was in my mind for a long time till I personally had a small accident when my car collided with another car. I had to file a police complaint against two men who were trying to be abusive in that particular situation. As I was walking into the police station to file the complaint, I realised how intimidating it is for women to take that first step towards any kind of legal process. There's a lot of legal information, but it's complex, it's unreliable, and it's not really helpful when one needs it. So Pink Legal was meant to close that gap. After about three years running Pink Legal, I got a call from Ridhima from HarperCollins, who's the editor of the book, saying that they're exploring a book on women's rights on the lines of what Pink Legal has done. I've always harboured a dream of becoming an author someday, so when this opportunity presented itself, I thought it it sounded very exciting..Giti: In your interactions with women who've approached you for help, what has surprised you most?.Manasi: When I launched Pink Legal, I thought that I would get the maximum number of inquiries regarding sexual harassment, because it's present everywhere, right? You step out onto the road and there'll be somebody making you uncomfortable. But within a week of launching Pink Legal, our inbox was flooded with queries on domestic violence. And even till today, 90% of the questions that we get are regarding domestic abuse from in-laws or from the husband. This was a new learning for me personally, especially because Pink Legal, as an internet platform, is accessible only to a certain section of people. And even within this section of people, domestic violence is so prevalent. That was quite a revelation and even today it continues to more or less be the same..Giti: You must have also come across people, mostly men, who speak about false sexual harassment and 498A cases. What are your thoughts on this issue?.Manasi: I believe nobody should file a fake case for anything, not just 498A, because you're abusing the system and the law and you're denying justice to people who really need it. But at the same time, because of my personal experience, I believe that the percentage of fake cases is very, very minuscule compared to the actual number of real cases which are filed and more than the cases filed, the cases that were unreported because they are never filed. Even the Supreme Court recently issued a statement in one of the judgments that the number of fake 498A cases are far fewer compared to the real cases of dowry harassment and other kinds of abuse. So let us not get into the mistaken impression that 498A is only there for abuse. It's actually there to protect women. And it is a very important section. It should not be abused, but let's not take away from the fact that women are still going through cruelty and abuse and it's very much a reality for many of them..Giti: In the book, you say that while it looks like India has very strong protections for women codified into law, what is on paper doesn't always translate into real life. What are some of these barriers that men and women face that we should know about?.Manasi: I think it's the way our system is. Firstly, the lack of awareness means that people don't know what they're going through or how to stand up or how to collect evidence and file a complaint. Secondly, even when you do file a complaint, say a sexual harassment one, the next step is that the police have to investigate and find some kind of evidence so that they can take it forward. If it's filed much later, then it's very difficult to find evidence and then it becomes a non-progressing case. You don't always necessarily get a response from the investigating agencies. If the case does reach the courts, then lawyers will try to find the most frivolous procedural lapse to bring the entire legal proceeding to a standstill, and the case goes on for years and years. What we started out with was to get justice, but at the end of the day, are you willing to put in the cost, the effort and the mental bandwidth towards whatever you may get? .Giti: Throughout the book, you have sections called food for thought, where you tell the reader what the law is and you ask them to think about whether it is right. Which is the one food for thought from this book that you hope people really think about?.Manasi: One of them speaks about the unsaid rules in Indian marriages. A marriage is a union between two equals and two people are coming together to live together. Is it fair that one person should leave their house and her entire life and move into the other person's life while the other person continues in their own comfort zone? Secondly, when an inter-faith couple want to get married under the Special Marriage Act, they are required to send out a public notice. In today's day and age, do we really need this? Do inter-faith couples really need to put their privacy at stake when they want to get married? This is not a requirement under other religious laws if you want to get married. That is something that I find is quite ridiculous and probably needs to change..Giti: There are tidbits from Bollywood strewn across the book to illustrate important issues women face. Could you tell us more about this?.Manasi: Movies and the entertainment industry have a huge influence on the mindsets of Indian society. It also mirrors society to an extent. I've given examples such as Thappad, which was a very positive influence because it shows how the female character stood up just for one slap. A lot of the time, women only stand up and take action when domestic violence gets out of control after they've been beaten and bruised and they can't take it anymore. I've used this example to show that even one slap counts as domestic abuse. On a lighter note, I've also used examples like Dil Dhadakne Do to show how society reacts to issues of marriage and divorce..A lot of the time women only stand up and take action when domestic violence gets out of control after they've been beaten and bruised and they can't take it anymore.Manasi Chaudhari.Giti: You've also used certain examples on how stalking is shown as romantic. Is this an issue that you've seen often?.Manasi: Yes, even I faced this personally when I was in high school. I've also written about the story of one of my friends who had a stalker in high school, and looking back now, because we have the information, we realise that this was actually a crime. But back then, I remember after school, if we went out to the movies, it was very common for boys to follow us everywhere. I think slowly the awareness is building. The movie you're talking about is probably Raanjhanaa, but it's just one among hundreds of examples of movies which have shown this. I've also spoken about a case in Australia where an Indian man was following two women. His lawyer argued that he was influenced by Indian movies which show that it's romantic to follow a woman, and that's what he was doing. They actually used the Bollywood argument!.Giti: Social media use has spiked exponentially and with that has come new avenues for harassment, cyberbullying and trolling. How can women protect themselves against these?.Manasi: I've spoken about this in the chapter on cyberbullying. I do believe that as women, it's not our job to alter our behaviour to make sure that somebody doesn't harass us. But unfortunately, we live in a world where there is no other option, and we would rather be safe than sorry. There are certain steps that we can take on a day-to-day basis. For example, if you're sharing a private picture of yourself, make sure that you cut off your face, you cut off any identifiable marks so that if this picture is exposed tomorrow accidentally or on purpose, it does not become a means to blackmail or threaten you or to bring you down. It's very common that when a relationship goes bad, the ex-partner starts trying to blackmail and "sextort" from the partner. For other kinds of harassment like death or rape threats, take screenshots of everything. Gather all the evidence possible and use the tools available on social media to block, restrict and report accounts. If it still persists or you want to take the legal route, if you have a cyber-crime cell in your city, go there first. If not, then go to a regular police station and submit whatever evidence you can. .Giti: In the book, you say that in the age of electric cars, Indian law is like a faithful old Ambassador car that's been passed down through generations with a fresh coat of paint slapped on it each time. What are some practical changes that you think lawmakers and courts can take to protect women further in this day and age?.Manasi: Number one is a law on cyberbullying. We don't have any proper law that protects women against it. We have to find it through the IT Act and a combination of criminal laws. There is a vacuum in law to deal with even death and rape threats, which are real threats to safety and security. We had Section 66A, but that was struck down by the Supreme Court because it was being misused for silencing free speech. We need a replacement which should be used specifically to protect women or anybody else from cyber bullying.Then there is the marital rape exception, which is a colonial hangover. Rape is rape whether you're married or unmarried. Your marital status has nothing to do with consent. There has been a lot of talk and movement about it, petitions have been filed, but nothing has come out of it so far. The courts have acknowledged it here and there in a judgment or two, but it has not turned into actionable law for women. Having a Supreme Court judgment is not going to help an average woman who will have to go and take that judgment and file a complaint against marital rape. We need laws in this space. Even the POSH Act. Although it's a very modern and progressive law, it lacks effectiveness because a woman has to file the complaint in the same organisation where she is facing harassment. And if you look at the Indian setup, it's mostly her superiors or friends of her manager or her colleague who are going to be sitting in judgment of her case. She's not going to be comfortable enough at the risk of losing her job or her reputation in her office space to actually file that complaint..Having a Supreme Court judgment is not going to help an average woman who will have to go and take that judgment and file a complaint against marital rape.Manasi Chaudhari.Giti: What is the most important thing that you hope people take away from this book?.Manasi: It's very important to know your rights because if you ever find yourself in a situation where you need to file a case or a complaint, you should not be running around last minute in a panic trying to look for answers or the right person. You should be aware of what to do in that situation and handle it in a cool and collected manner. It's like health insurance. You always take it not believing that you're going to fall sick ,but in case you do, it's there to support you and back you up.